Vinson Cunningham: This is Critics At Large, a podcast from The New Yorker. I'm Vincent Cunningham. 
Naomi Fry: I'm Alex Schwartz. And I'm Nomi Fry. Each week on this show, we make sense of what's happening in the culture right now and how we got here. Hi guys. Hey. Hello. Here 
Vinson Cunningham: we go.
Naomi Fry: Uh, how's everybody feeling? Feeling May-ish 
Vinson Cunningham: excited for this episode. 
Naomi Fry: Are we fired up? And ready to go. Turned up. 
Vinson Cunningham: Ready to go. Ready to go? Yes. We're fired up. Ready to? Ready to go. Thanks. In 
Naomi Fry: so today is our hotly anticipated return to our, I Need a critic episode. We first did this last October, and now we're back, baby.
Mm-hmm. Um, essentially it's, it's our advice hotline, you know? Yep. Our critics at large advice outline and. This is honestly, you know, one of my favorite kinds of episodes that we do. I just love to hear our listeners Me too. I love me too to hear from our listeners. I love to hear our listeners voices, their opinions, their thoughts.
It's, it's really like thrilling. They're out there. 
Alex Schwartz: Yeah. I don't wanna sound smug. However, we have the best listeners. They have such interesting thoughts and questions and everyone just challenges my own thinking and I'm really excited to hear what they have for us today. 
Vinson Cunningham: A real generous bunch of callers.
Yeah, 
Naomi Fry: I know. So over the past few weeks and months, we've been collecting submissions from our deal listeners about, you know, whatever cultural concerns or questions or dilemmas they have coming up in their lives that they want help with from us today. We all get to hear what you guys sent in, and we're gonna try our best to get you some answers.
Um, what does success look like for us here in this room? 
Vinson Cunningham: Ooh, well, you know, people are bringing to us not only their desires for new art, but really like questions of a, I don't know, existential, spiritual Variety. They're asking questions, deep questions about themselves.  Um, I can't say that. Uh, success for us means that we will solve those deeper issues, but to share art with somebody is to offer somebody a companion. And that's, that's all I wanna do. Be a companion and thinking and looking. And reading and seeing. That's it. Yeah. 
Naomi Fry: That's beautiful. I think that's exactly right. That is what it's all about.
Um, you guys, so that's today on Critics at Large. I need a critic May 20, 25 edition. 
Let's go. Let's hit it, you guys. 
________________


Before we start today, let's take a minute to talk about what's going on at the magazine because it's a special occasion. 
Alex Schwartz: The New Yorker is 100 years old. You may, you may have heard some, some talk about this murmurings. Some murmurings. Exactly. And to celebrate this momentous occasion, the New Yorker is rolling out a few special themed issues to celebrate the centenary over the year and hot on newsstands.
Mm-hmm. And news feeds, I dare say this very week is the New York issue. And all three of us are in it. 
Naomi Fry: We are. We are all in it. There's a great piece from our very own Vincent Cunningham about the New York Post. True. And why he loves to love it. 
Vinson Cunningham: I am sorry, but I do. 
Naomi Fry: It's okay. We all love it. I think maybe, maybe I do not as much as Vincent.
I do. Not as much as Vincent maybe. Okay. Alex, our very own, Alex Schwartz has written a comment opening the issue about. New York. Mm-hmm. And its wonders. Mm-hmm. And I appended, uh, a short introduction to a spectacular portfolio, um, from the photographer, Jillian Lobb, um, who has shot prominent New Yorkers in their living rooms.
Incredible photographs. Uh, and that's just, you know, that's just us. There's much more to discover in the issue. Uh, so I encourage you. Everyone, uh, to check it out and you can find it on New yorker.com or buy a hard copy. Um, and we'd be remiss if we didn't take this opportunity to say subscribe. Goddammit, if you don't already.
Alex Schwartz: Well, I gently say you might wanna subscribe because look, it's the critics in print, and if you love the critics in audio. You're gonna love the critics in print. I gotta tell you, I was, when I saw that the three of us were united in this issue. Yeah. My heart leapt. 
Vinson Cunningham: I didn't even realize it was happening until I, until I saw the issue. So, exactly. 
Alex Schwartz: It was a very pleasant surprise. And we said to ourselves, we must let the listeners know 
Vinson Cunningham: we don't just pod guys. No. We also do sometimes scribble. 
Naomi Fry: Yeah, we do scribble. Okay. But now it's advice time. Because we don't just pod, we don't just scribble. We are also much like Dr. Drew Pinsky, advice givers. 
Vinson Cunningham: I, I would not have been able to drop Dr. Drew's name, last name. 
Naomi Fry: I mean, it's Dr. Drew Pinsky, you guys. And, um, we each have a bunch of voicemails that listeners have sent in and we're gonna take turns playing those.
And who wants to start? 
Vinson Cunningham: I got something good for you. I've got somebody named Emily. Okay. And she's got a really good conundrum 
Naomi Fry: for.
You we're listening, Emily. 
Listener voicemail: Hey guys, so here's my situation. I love reading, but I suck at it. I just don't have the wherewithal or energy or patience for prosaic or highly complex literary fiction. But I don't wanna read shitty books. Do you guys have any recommendations for quality, fast-paced, readable books that aren't for or written by dummies?
Thanks. 
Alex Schwartz: Yep, we do. It's a pickle. 
Vinson Cunningham: This is a pickle. 
Alex Schwartz: Oh really? I'm like, yes, for sure. You can do it. Emily. 
Vinson Cunningham: I just mean a pickle as of like a personal problem. I can understand. Oh 
Alex Schwartz: totally. 
Vinson Cunningham: Why this? There's a problem for Emily, but I do think that we have. I'm seeing answers just flit and run across the faces of my Yeah.
Feel like we some, my colleagues. Yeah. I 
Naomi Fry: feel like we have some answers and I feel like this is something that Emily, you know, we all deal with, especially nowadays. Like, I, I look back at the hall season days as a, as a, as a youngster, you know, before the phone kids, before a full-time job, you know, like a, a time.
When I like fucking read like Fres, like Vanity Fair in like a week, you know what I mean? Like who was I? And whoa, I'm just saying. Yeah, no. Yeah. The reading flowed fast and hard. Wow. Again, wow. And fast enough now. It's certainly not as easy as it once was, and so this is a conundrum, Vincent, you're right, that I think.
We probably all face. Oh yeah. So it's kind 
Vinson Cunningham: of emblematic of the times. 
Naomi Fry: It is emblematic of the times. I, for me, one thing that makes it easier is I go to genre, and by genre I mean noir. Mm-hmm. Okay. By writers such as Jim Thompson, James M. Kane, you know, Raymond Chandler, Dashell, Hammett. They're often not very long.
They're filled with thrills. You know, it's like that, like old joke, old middle school joke, like sex, now that I have your attention, like, let me tell you about running for like class president. You know, remember that? Yeah. Yeah. So this is kind of like. What these books do. Mm-hmm. I mean, sex and crime and, you know, murder and, and all of that.
All of these good things, they will keep you glued to your seat, to the page. Um, but they also won't be like, whatever shitty airport books. That's my suggestion. I like it. 
Vinson Cunningham: I love it. Alex. 
Alex Schwartz: Well, I'm just gonna say to Emily, don't fight the problem. Work with the problem if attention span is an issue. Have you thought about a short story?
Go short. Damn short. There are some great short stories out there that pack everything you're looking for into a small space. You know, maybe read some Lori Moore, maybe go to a Classic Birds of America, read some Lori Moore. You get all that beautiful character development, all that rye language. You get it all, but you get it.
Short Edgar Ellen Poe. Loved the short story because he thought that the ideal reading experience should just be in one sitting, like seeing a movie or watching an episode of tv. There's no reason to drag it out forever. Go short. Fair enough. 
Vinson Cunningham: Uh, Emily, when I really don't feel like reading or I don't feel like, you know, dealing with a complex text, I go.
Biography or memoir because oh yeah, there are a parade of names and situations and scenarios and gossip. That's just fun. That's that. That's where I would go. Thank you for your offering, and trust me, there are many, many, many behind you. 
Alex Schwartz: I will start. Okay, great. So this, our first question comes from Chuck. Chuck has a question about fathers. Okay, let's listen. 
Listener voicemail: Dear New Yorker critics, my kids are well into their twenties, and when they were small, I noted that the archetype of a father seemingly was Homer Simpson, and it bugged me. So I'm wondering if there are. Examples that would, uh, present fatherhood in a positive light in this day and age? 
Alex Schwartz: I love this question. I will just say, because I do think this listener is onto something. There is a kind of under depiction of the father who's maybe more active in the, you know, in the way that a lot of contemporary fathers are.
Naomi Fry: Mm-hmm. 
Alex Schwartz: So I'm curious, what do you, what do you guys think? Does anything come to mind? 
Naomi Fry: What comes immediately to mind is, um, Bo Burnham's, uh, eighth grade. Oh yeah. From, from a few years back where, you know, it's interesting, I think, Alex, what you said about fathers and their role in their children's lives, I.
It often comes to the fore when there's a single dad. Right? When there's, when the mother, a, a as as it is in this movie, in this particular movie, which is about a girl who's going through puberty is in, is in middle school in eighth grade and it's kind of hellish and she has all of these like social.
Problems. It's kind of gently comedic, but also tragic and, and not tragic, but you know, sort of like heartrending in, in the right ways. And she, she lives with her father and, he’s the main caregiver. you know, it's, it's a touching depiction because he can't really help her, but the father tries. 
        CLIP: “Eighth Grade”
Vinson Cunningham: I would also recommend the Gilead novels by Marilyn Robinson. Um, the first book, uh, is about John Ames. He is a congregationalist pastor in a small town. And the book is written as a series of letters between John Ames, an older man who has learned that he is going to die and his very young son.
Um, and therefore it is in some ways like what fatherhood is really about. It's this, um, distillation of what parenthood is about, which is, um, transmission of not only values, but experiences. He is like trying to, um, tell this kid where he comes from in a very literal way before he dies, which. Kind of is what parenthood is
Alex Schwartz: Ooh, I love these recommendations and I have only one of my own to add and it's the Royal Doll Book. Danny Champion of the World.  Usually Royal Doll. The parents he created are horrible, miserable, nasty, don't like kids, and in Danny Champion of the world, he did exactly the opposite. It's about a young boy who lives with his father.
As Nomi was saying, you know, often in these cases there is no mother around. It's this kind of single relationship, and that's the case here, and they have a wonderful relationship. Danny idolizes his father. And his father also thinks his son is truly fantastic. And you see how a young man blossoms under that kind of love in the book.
It's not sentimental because it's, we're all doll, but that is something that I love about it. And the challenges that they go through are from the external world. They're not, um, about disappointment in their own relationship or falling short. And it's just fabulous and I think it's well worth, worth reading at any age really.
Naomi Fry: So, uh, I have a caller. It's Lily. She is from Athens, Greece. I love Athens. Lily, thank you for calling and leaving a message all the way from the Cradle of civilization. Fabulous. Fabulous. And let's listen to Lily's question. 
Listener voicemail: Hello, dear Critics, my question is the question that cannot be answered, I think. It's a question as old as time, or at least as old as readership.
Ooh, read a lot of books. Every year I read more books than the previous year My to Be Read list, however, keeps growing and growing and growing and never stops. My question is how do I get rid of the guilt? Of not reading all the books that I buy every year. Wow. 
Naomi Fry: Um, I mean, guilt, how does one get rid of guilt?
If we knew how to answer that, Lily? Um, 
Vinson Cunningham: I certainly wouldn't be a writer if I knew how to do that. 
Naomi Fry: I know. Are you kidding me? And the guilt about not reading enough is very familiar. Um. But I think one thing that I'd say is if we can try to let go, even just a little bit of this kind of like optimizing mindset, I guess, right?
Yes. Right? Mm-hmm. I mean because yes, it is really, that's right. Prevalent in every aspect of our lives. But I think there is something also, um, toxic about trying to reach. A goal that is, is frankly unreachable. Why not try to think about all that you are already getting from the books that you are already reading?
Why not feel good about yourself? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I'm speaking to myself. Mm-hmm. As much as I am to you, Lily. Let's face it. 
Alex Schwartz: Lily, if that didn't work for you, that very accepting, warm hug of a response, I'd like to try a little tough love. Oh mm. Nice. Lily,  I respect you. but I think you're humble bragging just a little bit.
Oh, you have a long list of books that you read every year, and each year you read more than the year before. And still you're putting this pressure upon yourself. And I would say, Lily, snap out of it. Snap right out of it. 
Vinson Cunningham: Cut it out, 
Alex Schwartz: cut it out. Because you know what, who cares? In the end, you gotta just say, here I am.
This is my time on earth. You know? And, and that's great. That's that. That's it. That, 
Vinson Cunningham: I think that you should think of the books. 'cause the, the, the specificity of the question was read, not reading the books that I buy. Oh, and, and, and so what I think everybody should really think about is that when you buy books, you are not just buying them for yourself.
You are amassing Absolutely. A personal library. Absolutely a concept which I think Armenia for the minimal and the useful and the utilitarian has sort of erased from our minds. But you are amassing something that is an archive of your interests and desires as much as you are amassing reading content for yourself. These books that you own are as much for the future, as much as they are for you in the moment.
Alex Schwartz: Beautiful. All right. Coming at you hot. Andy. Andy has a question that is to the point. Okay. And I think we can come up with some answers. Let's hear it. 
Listener voicemail: Hey, so I like to watch YouTube videos while I eat.
Um, mostly just like video essays and like informational stuff. Um, but I found recently that I like to watch more fictional things while I'm eating. Like recently I watched an animated short while I was eating a sandwich and I was like, oh, okay. This is very relaxing. Um, so are there any TV shows that I could binge while I eat lunch and dinner, if that makes any sense.
Alex Schwartz: Bye Andy. It makes so much sense. You know, all the other questions. I'm like, yeah, like I have an answer. I think it's a good answer, but there are a lot of other answers. I actually have the answer. Okay. Alex, question you go, Alex. 
Vinson Cunningham: What to watch while eating. What the Yeah, I'm really happy with my answer.
Alex Schwartz: The answer and an it's gonna change Andy's life. And I'm I, Andy, I wanna hear back from you about whether it has. It's the show, midnight Diner. Oh. Have you guys seen Midnight Diner? 
Naomi Fry: We have not. I have not. I have not. Okay, 
Alex Schwartz: so Midnight Diner is a Japanese show. It started in 2009. There are I think maybe something like 50 episodes.
At some point Netflix started developing it and it became a little bit slicker, but still great. But all of it is available on Netflix. The original and the more Netflix ified version, it takes place in Tokyo. Mm-hmm. In the Shinjuku district. And it is about a diner that is open every night from midnight to 7:00 AM and the chef who runs this diner only has on his menu sake pork and maybe one other thing I can't even remember, but he will make anything that his customers ask for as long as he has the ingredients.
And you get Yakuza guys, you get students, you get. People of all stripes who are hanging out and bringing some of their stories to the midnight diner and you get their specific food preferences, which in some cases are quite. You know, maybe particular, and in other cases, maybe something as simple as butter rice, which my husband and I then began to crave at all times.
Rice with butter and a little bit of soy sauce. Do, do you see the 
Naomi Fry: cooking 
Alex Schwartz: happen? Yes. Okay. Okay. And in the credit sequence, you see the most delicious sizzling happen. But yes, master cooking the entire time 
        CLIP: Midnight Diner
and the cooking is very much happening. Happening. Serving is happening. The eating is happening.
Yum. And it's all about a certain kind of nightlife. People. Coming together, getting to know a little bit of each other and their stories. It's comforting. It's delicious. It's wonderful. It will make you feel. Less alone and happy to share your meal with these folks. 
Vinson Cunningham: Interesting. Yeah. See, I number one, want to watch that so badly now, so thank you.
You're welcome. Number two though, uh oh. I don't wanna watch, I don't wanna do food on food. 
Naomi Fry: You don't? I don't want food 
Vinson Cunningham: on food. I don't, if I'm eating something and watching something that is food related. 
Naomi Fry: Oh, I love food on food. 
Vinson Cunningham: The, the, the, the, the risk there that this entails is. The, the opening up of a gap of the enj between the enjoyment that I'm having with my food and the potential enjoyment that is being, that is being portrayed on screen.
Um, if. What I'm watching is making me hungry in a different way than what I have will satisfy. Now I'm, I'm entering into a crisis 
Naomi Fry: That's so funny. Do you understand? Yeah. So like you can 
Vinson Cunningham: make me more or less satisfied with what I have based on what's happening on screen. Mm-hmm. Therefore, no food related things while I'm wa eating food.
Vinson Cunningham: The right thing to watch while eating food. This is gonna be trad of me. This is just like, don't say like 
Naomi Fry: er or something. Just tell, 
Alex Schwartz: just kid us with it. We're, we're waiting. It's 
Vinson Cunningham: sports. Oh. Oh. Right now we're in the middle of the NBA playoffs. Second round. Things are heating up. It’s been done for centuries. 
Naomi Fry: Okay. Absolutely not. 
Vinson Cunningham: Sports are always on. 
Naomi Fry: Absolutely not because the rejected capital R because the activity.
Of the sport versus the passivity, the enjoyable, beautiful passivity of sitting on your ass and eating whatever delicious thing. Baseball and a hot dog. What are you talking about? Well, I don't know. I, I love food on food and I will even go, one of my favorite things, especially as a child, was to read.
About food and eat food. Mm. So food on food. 
Alex Schwartz: Vincent, I think you should feel happy that most people agree with you. Just not the two people in this room. 
Vinson Cunningham: That's fair enough.
Naomi Fry: You have more questions? Well, we have more answers. Critics at Art from the New Yorker will be right back.
:: MIDROLL 1 :: 
Alex Schwartz: I am going to Clara. So Clara wrote in with an email, Clara has just turned 26 as as of three days ago. And Clara, I'm gonna do my absolute best to give you voice. Here I go. 
I need some good media about the self-centered existentialism. Existential narcissism question mark that people I question mark feel in their mid twenties about contending with being average and ordinary and unremarkable, and the things we do to cope with that.
As an example, the scene I think captures this most is in the TV show girls when Marnie, mid twenties and aimless. Is asked what she wants to do most in the world and randomly decides she wants to be a singer, A decision that gave us her iconic rendition of Kanye West’s stronger. I'm trying to read more of the high school English class classics, so I'd love any recommendations in that category in Listlessness, Clara
In Listlessness, listlessness.
All right, guys. What do you got? What do you got? I got something, but I wanna hear what you got first. Clara, I 
Naomi Fry: would say. Gustav Bert's Sentimental Education. 
Vinson Cunningham: Great book. 
Naomi Fry: Talk about Listlessness. Talk about Frederic Fred Murrow. who is wandering. Around Paris. Oh, poor boy. Is it the 1830s? 
Alex Schwartz: It's coming up on 1848.
1848. It's back. You're right, you're right. Europe is 
Naomi Fry: feeling 
Alex Schwartz: it. 
Naomi Fry: Revolution is a boil. Revolution is a boil. Revolution is a boil. And yet, and yet, Frederik. Is thinking of himself and his love life and which is messed up. Which is messed up. He has an impossible love object, a married woman. Mm-hmm. But it is about a kind of youthful listlessness, uh, but also the illusions of youth that turn to disillusion, um, towards the end of, of the book, I would say.
And it is definitely, you said that you're looking for a classic, so. I would say that that is definitely a classic that you should dive into. 
Alex Schwartz: Yep. Alright, Clara, so here we go. Um, there comes a time in every young person's life when they must for the first time read Middlemarch and ugh. Yeah. You have come upon that time and I wanna say to you, congratulations, you're feeling a little bit droopy.
You're feeling like you're not so great that maybe you thought you'd be somewhere by now and you're not. You thought you were exceptional. You're seeing the world as big and there are other stars in it. Cool. Now it's time to read Middle March, George Elliot's novel from 1872. This is a book I think that I.
Really can stand up to a lifetime of readings as our wonderful colleague, Rebecca Mead, has made clear in her book, my Life in Middle March. But it's a great time to read it now because the premise of your question is that you feel that you're not remarkable and you have to deal with that. And there are people in this book who feel the same way, who turn out to be remarkable in ways that they did not initially value.
And there are people who, when you first meet them, seem to be exceptional and destined for great things. For whom life amounts to not very much. And the message of the book and the message I have for you is life is long and full of surprises. And just because you're feeling not so hot right now, three days after turning 26, and you're feeling that you haven't made good on the promise of life of whatever you are at the beginning of the road, my friend, so read Middle March, enjoy those amazing characters.
You're gonna come out somewhere different from where you started, I promise you. 
Naomi Fry: Okay. This is, this is, this is a good question, you guys. I don't know exactly what I think about a response, but I, I love this question and it's from Mary. 
Naomi Fry: Let's hear it. 
Listener voicemail Hi. Critics at large. I have a question. Um, how do you tell what's good acting and what's bad acting? I'm a big movie fan and I feel like I know good acting, or at least I think I do. And then I'll listen to a movie, podcast or read a piece of, um, criticism on it and just get met with. This was the worst acting ever. Um, so what are kind of hallmarks of good acting technique or how can I get better at determining when someone is being a good actor? Alright, thanks 
Naomi Fry: Alex. I feel like you will have something to say to this because you, I remember you wrote a beautiful piece about the method. Um, and how right 
Alex Schwartz: you are. 
Naomi Fry: Yeah. That I have something to say. So why don't you, I'm very right. You are. So why don't you start and then we bounce off you. 
Alex Schwartz: So Mary, I want you to know something right now and I want you to get this through your head. Everyone is making it up. What people think is good acting. This is a product of personal taste. Cultural taste. The times we live in, it all depends. It all changes. So yeah, Nomi brings up the method. until the method came along with Lee Strasberg in and before that was Stanislavsky in the late 19th, early 20th centuries. Acting was this very stiff, very formal thing. It was de de declamatory. It was, you know, I want my voice to carry to the back of the theater. And put very briefly, the method through a whole bunch of different methods, brought naturalism into first the theater and then into cinema. And so I think one thing that people often talk about with good acting is naturalism. The idea that you really feel like you were right there with the character. That the person could just be, um. You know that, that, that you feel that there is no acting like that. When people will say, I couldn't even tell they were acting and they think that's good acting. It could be, but. I think it is fundamentally about what it produces. In you. Good acting excites you. 
Alex Schwartz: Vincent, you're true. You know, Vincent and I, we were co theatre critics for a while. 
Vinson Cunningham: We were. 
Alex Schwartz: So what's your answer to this question? 
Vinson Cunningham: We saw, I, I, I mean, I, I've seen so much acting, 
Alex Schwartz: you've seen so much acting, 
Vinson Cunningham: you know, uh, to me the hallmarks of good acting, is, A marriage of artistry that the actor is not simply conveying to us text and also not just off on their own sort of highly mannered thing, but they're, um, seeing what happens when those things come together. Mary, if you live in New York or you don't go see a play that Kara Young is in. Oh my God. This woman has been tearing up Broadway, She is the Ferrari of actors. She can be naturalistic, she can be, but then she's like Lucille Ball, somebody who can, um, look at the text and decide, make a lot of interesting choices that just change your.
Conception of what the play or the thing even was. That to me is what an actor is. I've got a really interesting question. Uh, it's from Flora who emailed instead of sent a message. Flora says, I struggle to find morality in the absence of religion. I. As an engineer and a PhD student, a system of ethics is of high importance to me, both in terms of academic integrity, integrity in my day-to-day life.
However, I do not ascribe to any religion and therefore have no real preconceived notion of what is right and what is wrong. My plea critics is this. I would like to learn more about moral systems, specifically those not attached to religion and about how they intertwine with our modern society. Please advise books, readings, or any applicable media.
Flora is hungry for ethics. 
Naomi Fry: Okay, this is a big question and it's actually not the kind of question that I feel like I'm really. Like I'm, I'm not really the critic to answer this kind of question. Maybe because I'm very interested in specificity rather than kind of like large abstract systems. Mm-hmm.
Like in my preferences of what I like to read and watch, I guess. Yeah. Nothing has 
Alex Schwartz: gone on record on this show as being anti philosophy. 
Naomi Fry: Exactly. But I was thinking on this and it struck me that a kind of like. Close to home example of something that I've read that gives me a sense of a community ruled by dependable moral law is Charles Schultz's peanuts.
Alex Schwartz: Okay. I love it. It's so good. We 
Naomi Fry: have all of these characters that are living together. They are all children, but these children are often kind of like conduits towards kind of adult. Adult concerns, right? The, the fact that they kind of work through problems together, whether, you know, I mean, again, Lucy often pulls the, the, um, the football away when Charlie Brown is trying to kick it, you know, again and again, this is kind of like a, a, a repeat kind of, or repetition of bad behavior that happens.
I'm not saying that it's a, it's a place where everything is perfect, but it's a. Place where things get worked out between the characters. And when I think about goodness and not goodness, as in like the behavior is always good, but just kind of like a general attempt at morality, at least right in a society that kind of like has its own code of how people should act.
I think about peanuts as a kind of like comforting force of order in the world. I, I, I would, I would, I would suggest that. 
Alex Schwartz: It sounds great. Vincent, did you have a thought? 
Vinson Cunningham: You said divorced from any, um, religious system? Flora, and I respect that. I would also say that my, my answer to this has a priest in it, so I'm sorry, but First Reformed the recent movie by Paul Schrader is about.
A, uh, pastor of a small church, he is like shaken into this moral crisis because he meets a fervent environmental activist. Somebody from a sphere that doesn't necessarily have to do with his, uh, with his faith or with his particular mission, um, throws him into a crisis of action radicalism, uh, how one weighs the pressing.
Um, moral emergency against an already established moral template. 
        CLIP: First Reformed
It's a really great film and I recommend it wholeheartedly. 
Alex Schwartz: Okay, so this, this one, this is, this is one that really I want us to address and I'm curious to hear answers 'cause I'm not totally sure what to say. It's from Hillary. 
Listener voicemail: Hey critics, my name is Hilary and I need your advice Um, you see, I am a minister, oh, a Unitarian Universalist minister, and I bring a lot of pop culture, specifically, uh, music into the worship services and sermons that I write and I've been running into a roadblock lately because the world, as we know, is such a mess right now. There's so much suffering, so much pain, so much anxiety that so many of us. Our feeling and I don't feel like it's okay to bring in pop culture. And so I find I'm starting to write, you know, more. Philosophy, heavy theology, heavy intellect, heavy sermons, which are fine. The people like 'em, but I'm just not feeling it.
I'm not feeling the joy as much anymore. I'm not feeling the nourishment. And I'm wondering if you have any recommendations on pop culture sources. It could be a book, it could be a movie, it could be music that I could look to, um, both from my own spirit and also my preach. You know, my preach to these times, it won't make me feel quite so guilty about, you know, just wanting to bop around to Taylor Swift sometimes.
So thank you for your time, for your advice and uh, many blessings. You are certainly in my prayers, my friends. Thanks for the wonderful show you put together each week. 
Naomi Fry: Oh, I feel so blessed. That's so wonderful. It's really moving. Um, Vincent, I feel like you're the, you're the closest to a, a church 
Vinson Cunningham: perspective.
Naomi Fry: Perspective. Yeah. Uh, do you, do you have any suggestions for Hillary? 
Vinson Cunningham: Yeah, no, I, I feel Hillary's, uh, conundrum, I would say. In the sermons that I have, the many, many sermons that I have sat through in my life, uh, good and bad, that pop culture, um, can be mined regardless of emotional valence.
Obviously it has like an initial freeze on that's like funny and interesting. Um, but then addressing its actual philosophical content. The, the preacher, the speaker, the writer is the one who determines the mood, not necessarily. The mood of the thing itself. You can drift off that mood, but you can also change that mood. If you want to see an interesting and actually very fun example of this, there is a, uh, preacher, an AME, African Methodist Episcopal, uh, denomination, uh, who I'm aware of because I follow him on Twitter.
His name is Meek Thomas. He went viral for bringing the lyrics of the rapper glo-rilla into his sermon. 
        CLIP: Melech Thomas sermon
It's just the most fun thing in the world, and I'm always happy when preachers are trying to like. As we say, read the signs of the times in whatever way they can. 
Naomi Fry: That was great, Vincent. Perfect. Uh, okay, so, so we have a question here from George who's from the Netherlands.
Listener voicemail: Hi guys. Um, well you want something personal, so here we go. Uh, I've recently been in therapy and one of the, the things, it has been good, and one of the things I'm learning is to not either suppress or, or, or repress, uh, my emotions. And what I'm looking for in culture right now is, is things that nudge me along that process.
Something that allows me to let loose and feel my feels and maybe cry a little even. I don't want it to be in a, in a, in a heart wrenching, unbearable. The world has gone to hell kind of way, and I am also not looking for rescue dog videos, I'm looking for a nice cry.
Thank you guys for making this lovely podcast. Have a lovely day. 
Naomi Fry: Thank you, George. 
Vinson Cunningham: I love this question. I know. And I have something. Okay. I think, go ahead. Something that has done this for me. Yeah. Um, it is the television show from a couple years ago. Written directed. Starring. Hmm. The great to me, Pamela Adlon Better things.
I 
Alex Schwartz: was thinking the same thing, Vincent. 
Vinson Cunningham: And the, one of the great benefits of this is that you will watch this show, which is a beautiful archive of family relationships. Triumphs sorrows, sort of slapstick comedy, and just like the, the absolutely poignant fact of motherhood. And you will cry if you allow yourself to.
Um, and then you can read the great piece about it by Alexandra Schwartz in The New Yorker magazine. What? In 2020? 
Alex Schwartz: I'm flattered my friend 
Vinson Cunningham: Alex Schwartz. Um, and so you can pair your viewing and hopefully crying with. A wonderful companion piece by one of your critics. That's what I got. 
Naomi Fry: That's a great suggestion.
Boo yell.
Vinson Cunningham: Um, heres Monica. I think she speaks for so many of us in the sort of, at least first half of her. Issue here. 
Listener voicemail: Hi critics. My name is Monica. I'm a big fan of the show. I look forward to it every week. Thank you, Monica. Thank you. Um, I think I speak for many of your American listeners when I say that I am not having a good time right now.
Mm oh yeah. Um, interesting crises abound on national, international, personal, probably intergalactic levels. Um, so I'm just calling in the hopes that you can recommend me a life affirming poetry collection, or maybe alternatively a really lyrically dense music album. Just something that will help us feel the feelings and maybe find the itty bitty nuggets of light that I'm really struggling to see at the moment.
Thanks, and thanks also for being one of those nuggets of light yourselves. Monica, I have two. Thank you, 
Alex Schwartz: Monica. Yeah, thank you. I have, I have two things for you, Monica, and I wanna hit you with them. So the first one is the book of poems called OS by Sharon Os, which was published in 2016. She is. Certainly linguistically dense. It's not music, but these are wordy poems, which I absolutely love.
She has a use of language, she wields language and a precision and a playfulness with language that I can't get enough of. And OES is all about, um, praising things that often go unraised. For instance, she has an ode to the hymen she has because she's, let's just put it out there. She's a very sexy poet in a way that is truly awesome.
I love it. And she also has a deeply religious background, which comes in here and there. But the whole point of OES is just to praise things that are everyday, that are fundamental, that are part of life, that are often unsung, that are not seen as glorious. Um. And I think it could really bring some joy to you and help awaken you to life's many delights and beauties.
And the other thing I have for you is something that fewer people will know, but I hope more will after I share this. It's an album, and it's actually by a friend of mine whose name is TJ Douglas. The album is called Dying And the reason the album is called Dying is because. TJ is a palliative care chaplain, so they work with people who are dying and wow, this is just a very regular part of their life.
And they released this album coming up on a year ago in June of 2024. And I'm just gonna be honest here, when I saw that TJ had this album called Dying, I didn't really wanna listen to it. Yeah, I was nervous and I just sort of thought, I don't know if I can go there right now, but I have recently listened to this album and.
It is so beautiful and so wonderful and so philosophical, and so just also really in touch with the every day that I highly, highly recommend it. There's, I love all the songs here, but there's a song in particular that I love called, it Means What It Means, and it just opens with the narrator of the song, crying on a Train, and the way that TJ uses both voice, their voice, um, their music, and.
The beauty of language I think will really hit the spot for you. So embrace it and I hope more people discover and love this album dying.
Naomi Fry: Okay, dad does it for our voicemails. Um, and listeners, even though we couldn't get to all of them over the course of this episode, we did listen to each and every one. And thank you so much for writing into us with your questions. In a minute, we'll wrap up with some of our own. This is Critics at Large from The New Yorker. Stick around.
:: MIDROLL 2 :: 
Alex Schwartz: I have a dilemma. 
Naomi Fry: I, I also have, I mean, it's not a dilemma, it's, it's a, well, 
Alex Schwartz: hit us with it. Let's, let's get to it. 
Naomi Fry: Okay. Okay, you guys. So we've been giving advice to others, right? To listeners, our beloved listeners who were calling in with their questions, their dilemmas. Um, but, you know, we're also people and we have our own problems.
And don't you forget it, listeners. 
Alex Schwartz: I have a, I have a conundrum, okay? Or it's more of a question. But, um, you two are the perfect people to ask, okay? Because it's about. Children and parenting and both of you have preceded me in the parenting zone. So here's my question. 
Naomi Fry: Okay. 
Alex Schwartz: As you know, I am the mother of a young son who's soonish gonna be two and a half.
Mm-hmm. And he is just observing culture right now. He is spooned up and he has a taste for the high. We've done a Beethoven's fifth Symphony. Obsession. 
Alex Schwartz: We've done a Mozart's magic flute obsession. Mm-hmm. Oh yeah, Neil love that too. We're now in the thick, in the absolute thick of a Nutcracker obsession where every morning he says, I wanna watch Clara's Dream.
And we get our butts on that couch and we watch an eight and a half minute clip of Clara and the mouse fight and the Nutcracker, and it's all extremely Freudian and. He's gotten super into this stuff, but he also whips through. So like Papano shouting the name of Papano every minute, two weeks ago.
Haven't heard the word papano. Clara right now is huge. Clara's gonna be over what's next? What do I feed to him next? 
Vinson Cunningham: Ooh, ooh. Um, an interest in the high 
Alex Schwartz: and it doesn't have to stay there. 
Vinson Cunningham: And a rapid. A rapid pace. Yeah. 
Alex Schwartz: I remember 
Naomi Fry: really loving good old Peppa Pig. I love Peppa Pig. Mm. I'm with you. I mean, it's so cute.
Yeah. They're like, we love it five minutes long. We love the PEPs. You know, Mr. Potato, Ms. Rabbit, um, you know, Emily Elephant, like such a cast of characters. Mm-hmm. Uh, I would just double down on Peppa. All right. Great one. 
Vinson Cunningham: Um, I would get him into someone who I think is one of our mutual enthusiasms. Um, I.
Some of the works of Aaron Copeland. Mm. Because it's so sort of like America based. You can teach about the west, you can teach about topography. I'm thinking of Appalachian Spring. Appalachian Spring, yeah. As a huge one. Um, I have a particular fetish, of course, for the, for the, like the piano blues are my favorite, but that might be a little, little dark for young Ben.
But Billy, the kid 
        CLIP: Billy the Kid
These are good works that are exciting, fresh, kind of thrilling. 
Alex Schwartz: I think he's more at Peppa, but Billy the kid is coming up fast. 
Naomi Fry: Yeah. Vincent, you have your own question.
Vinson Cunningham: Yeah. This is, it's an easy, common, almost cliche thing. What are you planning to listen to this summer? I'm just hoping to go to the beach a lot. What's some beach music maybe? 
Naomi Fry: Beach music, beach music. Oh God. How about the Beach Boys? 
Vinson Cunningham: I do like The Beach Boys, and maybe I'll get back into them. How 
Naomi Fry: about the Beach boys?
How about the beach? How about the Dennis Wilson solo album? Oh, 
Vinson Cunningham: see, I don't know that. I don't know that. Okay. Well 
Naomi Fry: maybe you, maybe you try that. 
Vinson Cunningham: Okay. I'm also, oh my God, Heim comes out this summer and so I'm You do have, I can't wait for You're ready. The new Heim. You're 
Naomi Fry: all ready. And 
Vinson Cunningham: I think the bad bunny that I loved so much when it came out is gonna make a big return.
This summer. 
Alex Schwartz: See, you should be advising us, 
Naomi Fry: but 
Vinson Cunningham: I, but I have to, 
Naomi Fry: I always want more. Um, okay. I have a question. As you guys know, I have returned to work on a book of essays. I listen to music when I write. Alex, I know we share a love of listening to Bach.
We love JSB. Yeah. 
Vinson Cunningham: Mm-hmm. 
Naomi Fry: But I'm looking for some more. So did 
Vinson Cunningham: Sa Bello, by the way. That was his Really? That was what he did. 
Naomi Fry: Really 
Vinson Cunningham: shared a house in Tivoli with Ralph Ellison and Ellison would just hear the Bach just blasting from his room. 
Naomi Fry: Wow. Anyway, that is our wavelength. Yeah. So, What would you suggest as listening music?
Alex Schwartz: Hmm. So I love the Brazilian musician, Ana Veloso. Mm-hmm. Okay. And I think he has one of the greatest voices of all time. But what makes him really good to listen to while you write is that he is singing in Brazilian Portuguese, so you're not distracted by knowing what he's singing about.
Sure. Because I, I know you like I are not a Portuguese speaker. I'm 
Naomi Fry: not a Portuguese speaker, unfortunately. So there are 
Alex Schwartz: many different places you could start with ano, you know, you could go to the best of Katano Veloso, which is a kind of hits album. But the album that I really have on Loop very often as I write mm-hmm.
Is an album called. Off editorial, which Tana recorded with his three sons. Hmm. It's a gorgeous album and moves through all the moods. There's, uh, somber moments. There are many joyful moments. 
        CLIP: Caetano Veloso
It's just absolutely beautiful. You feel that you've been on a journey and I find it to be a perfect writing accompaniment.
Vinson Cunningham: I so rarely am able to write with music. 
Alex Schwartz: Oh, really? 
Vinson Cunningham: That this is, um, it's kind of moot painful for me. 
Naomi Fry: Okay. 
Vinson Cunningham: I used to listen to stuff that. I knew so well that it would just kind of slip through my brain. You 
Naomi Fry: totally, yeah. 
Vinson Cunningham: And so, um, the one thing that I found for like a year or so I could write to was the first Crosby stills in 
Naomi Fry: Match.
Oh. I listen to them all the time. That's so funny. I could, I can that I've just been listening to Deja vu all the time. Like the last couple weeks. Yeah. Yeah. 
Vinson Cunningham: Uh, Guinevere.
        CLIP: Guinevere
 I can, I can write to that show. Put 
Naomi Fry: had green eyes like your, like your, your I Boom. Boom. Just, I I just bought 
Naomi Fry: an um, uh, the David Crosby autobiography from 1988.
Oh, that's a great hop report back. He's got a life. Oh, what a life. Oh my God. What a life it was.
This has been critics at Art. Our senior producer is Rhiannon Corby and Alex Barish is our consulting editor. Our executive producer is Steven Valentino. Conde Nast's. Head of Global Audio is Chris Bannon. Alexis Quadra composed her theme music, and we had engineering help today from James Yos. With Mixing by Mike Kuman, you can find every episode of Critics at large at New yorker.com/critics.
Listeners, a huge thank you for sending in your questions. We, we love episodes like this one because it's a chance for us to hear from you. And remember, even if we're not actively working on an episode of I Need a Critic, you can always send us a voice memo asking for advice. We do bang these things for future episodes, so don't be a stranger.
Next week. Our episode is all about. The Pope. 
Alex Schwartz: Yeah, I'm just gonna say it right now. I'm a conclave girly, so I'm excited for this one. 
Naomi Fry: We'll see you for that.